Health care reform

**Slash** · 18 Nov. 2009 03:33am

What are your opinions on the new Health Care Bill?

Please debate.

18 Nov. 2009 03:46am

Not sure about the details of the current health care bill. I know it's not the perfect health care system that other countries utilize, but I blame conservatives for that. So much shit had to be rewritten to please the conservatives. But, whatever. It's still a step in the right direction. No doubt it's not perfect, but it's closer to perfection than we're currently at, which is nowhere. I'm sure the kinks will be ironed out, but before we can progress towards the health care reform needed and deserved, we have to take this small step. Barack is doing a good job in his attempt to please both parties. He may be getting a lot of shit from both parties as a result, but he's actually getting things done. Even Lincoln got a lot of shit from both parties because he tried to please both sides in order to achieve his goals in office. I'm not saying Barack is a Lincoln, but the decisions he's making - what should be included and what shouldn't - aren't easy. And he's apparently doing a damn good job of it, since he's got a health care bill past the house, further than any health care bill has been before.
So, no, it's not perfect. It's nowhere near perfect. But I see it as a necessary step, and hope it will be altered to perfection in the future, after America has gotten used to the idea of having a socialized health care system.

**Darkxxstar** · 18 Nov. 2009 03:47am

wut is a health care bill?

**Slash** · 18 Nov. 2009 03:52am

@Game: Why exactly do you support the bill?

18 Nov. 2009 04:09am

My take on health is the same as my take on education. I believe everyone is entitled to it. We have socialized education, and nobody gives a damn. In fact, I believe the country is better off with socialized education. Your efficacy in your career should not be based on the wealth of your parents.
To be honest, though, I'd quite likely settle for free health care for minors (i.e. people who are dependent on others for all things that require money, especially in excess amounts), and I imagine and hope that that's something conservatives would agree on (of course not all of them, but I assume it would be easier to pass a free-health-care-for-minors bill than the current health care bill). But, since health care is the #1 bankruptcy cause, it'd probably be better for the economy to have it for everyone.

**C0FFINCASE** · 18 Nov. 2009 04:21am

I am completely against health care reform. I don't give a damn about anyone else. I shouldn't have to take care of anyone but myself. The only reform we need is to make it so hospitals stop giving the free services they already do so I can pay less taxes.
Socialization lowers the quality of health care available, decreases availability, cause there to be less doctors, drives taxes way up, devalues the human life, and makes medicine about what's cheapest not health, removes doctor- patient confidentiality.
Look at how long it took the government to bankrupt social security? You think they can run health care?
@Game: "the perfect health care system in other countries" are you freaking serious? The health care in all socialized health care countries is mediocre at best.
You give the minors health care at the cost of the old. I'm friends with a great deal many people from those "perfect health care countries" that left them to come here and have been freaking out about the health care bill because they've seen what socialized health care is and don't like it or want it.

18 Nov. 2009 05:01am

tbh, I don't believe it does any of the things you're claiming it does. Especially some moral play you sneaked in there about devaluing human life. Because "taking care of anyone but yourself" and "giving a damn about anyone else" is quite like stating that their life is valueless.
The quality isn't going to lower to anything less than what it is, however I do fear that it may not increase at as fast of a rate. But that's a fair trade-off, in my opinion.
"Decreases availability"? In what sense? Waiting rooms in countries with socialized health care are no longer than waiting rooms here.
Whether or not there are less doctors is dependent on whether or not their pay will be altered, which is dependent on the system itself - not all socialized systems result in less pay.
The taxes issue has already been addressed. The health care reform is being paid for by cut spending in government. Your taxes are already being used to fund other, unnecessary governmental things. Things that aren't being used. i.e. your tax dollars are currently being wasted. The current health care bill simply redirects those tax dollars already being collected to the new health care reform.
And the argument that socialized health care makes medicine about what's cheapest as opposed to what's healthiest is quite the opposite. In a system where what medicine you get is based on how much money you make (i.e. capitalism, the current system), the medicine you get is based on cost, not health. In a system where anyone can get any medicine, the doctor can prescribe what's best for the patient regardless of the price of the medication.
Remove doctor-patient confidentiality? Probably. I'm not sure of the specifics on this in the current bill, but it would certainly be optional. If your confidentiality is more important than free treatment, you can surely pay without the public option and keep your herpes outbreak to yourself. Not that there would be any difference in doctor-patient confidentiality that doesn't already exist among private insurance companies. "I don't want the government knowing about my medical problems. But this private company can!"

You give the minors health care at the cost of the old.

We give minors education at the cost of the old. Are you saying that's a bad thing?

**Slash** · 18 Nov. 2009 05:13am

@GAMEChief: Many people from other countries with socialized health care like this come to the United States to be diagnosed and treated since the waiting list to be seen by a doctor in their country is so long that it could cost them their life due to the horrifically long waiting lists. Some aren't treated properly because of their age, and their government doesn't consider them young enough to make the expenditure worth while. Do you want your government deciding how you should live, and what kind of health you will enjoy or suffer through?

18 Nov. 2009 06:16am

Many people from this country move to other countries with socialized health care to be diagnosed and treated since the cost of medicine here is so expensive that it could cost them their lives due to the horrifically large medical bills. Some aren't treated properly due to their social class, and the hospitals don't consider them wealthy enough to bother saving their lives.
A socialized alternative does not get rid of one's personal ability to pay for treatment. If the government says they won't pay, then pay yourself. It's a strange statement to say that it's a bad thing for the government to deny coverage to old people, but it's a good thing for the government to deny coverage to everyone.

**sighkick** · 22 Dec. 2009 02:28am

My opinion is why would i want something that the Maker doesnt want..if he isnt using it then i sure in the hell am not using it

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