Zone Control - How to harass and not be harassed

[GAMEchief]

Quick tutorial on what zone control is. What is the optimal location to stand, to avoid getting your shit rekt, and to maximize the amount of shit that you rek

[TerrorFace]

Will watch more of it later, but looking good!

Definitely a must-see for support players out there, as (to me) they're generally held to lower standards compared to other roles and often don't make use of positioning and their regen to get off the harass on foes to dominate their lane when able. Lane presence OP.

[GAMEchief]

If a support isn't winning their lane, I don't know what they're doing. A support's job is to win early game so that the carry can safely and easily transition into late game. Dominating a lane is highly dependent on the supports.

[TerrorFace]

I agree 100%. I'm a utility player, and will often find myself in the offlane solo or, with a bit more luck, solo mid, but I do pride myself in my laning if I do pick to play support. I'm sort of what some may consider more barbaric in approach, but I have a "show you who's the boss of this lane" mentality and do often attempt to race whoever's mid at scoring that first blood (but I do stick to low MMR, where opponents respond so poorly to harass and thus set up easier kills [Why don't they ever buy more regen???? lol]).

Just when most others play it even in mid-MMR and even sometimes in higher, it's just a bit too passive for my tastes, and they somehow end up confused as to how they didn't do more for their lane even though they were off in the jungle stacking for almost all of the laning phase.

Support: "But my hero is known to have strong lane presence..."
Me: "You don't really have a strong lane presence if you were barely ever even in the lane."
Support: "I still don't get it."
Me:

[Kingz V]

Zone control eh'

I've seen a similar video to this from some LOL video set, but it focused more on lane positioning.

As a novice dota player it hard to know were the safe zone. Particular champions like sniper make it hard to be safe ever it feels like.

[TerrorFace]

Just be patient and then man up on Sniper, as he will usually make use of his additional attack range to pelt you with hits, but can get too confident and get out of position. Against him, I like to pick Juggernaught to solo the offlane versus Sniper and a support, if he has one, as a mispositioned Sniper will easily get mowed down by a Spin2Win. ^^

Edit: This was touched in the vid, but Jugg does bring up another aspect of the zone that's super important - Ability ranges. A hero I like playing is Sven, and a lot of newer players and careless ones seem to forget just how far his can hit with his stun and just play against him as a short-ranged melee threat (600 range + 225 stun radius upon impact, -drools-). x)

[GAMEchief]

Zone control eh'

I've seen a similar video to this from some LOL video set, but it focused more on lane positioning.

As a novice dota player it hard to know were the safe zone. Particular champions like sniper make it hard to be safe ever it feels like.

Sniper has the longest range of all heroes, so if you don't feel safe you're playing him wrong.

[Kingz V]

I meant playing against sniper when his zone can go over yours.

Another match up thing that is tough to handle is hand to hand fighters lanes against a marksman.

[TerrorFace]

In a melee vs ranged match-up in lane, if you're an Agility-based melee hero, be sure to pick up a Poor Man's Shield. It adds to your base attack advantage with the stats and the increased damage block is amazing!

[GAMEchief]

I meant playing against sniper when his zone can go over yours.

Another match up thing that is tough to handle is hand to hand fighters lanes against a marksman.

Don't lane a melee carry against a Sniper, pick a different hero or alt lanes. If you have to, you could get a Stout Shield start/early from sideshop. Turn it into a Poor Man's Shield if you're agi, Vanguard in rare instances, or sell it late game when you need the slot.

If you're safelane against Sniper, have your support pull the lane so you can farm at your tower or under tower (if you're good enough at last hitting under tower), giving you large zoning (tower range minimum, gank potential mostly) against Sniper, keeping him further back (or dead, if he over extends and your mid/jungle can gank).
If you're mid against Sniper, just stay uphill. There is no zoning problems mid. Deny better if your creeps are outpushing theirs.
You just shouldn't be offlane melee against a Sniper, unless your hero doesn't need farm. A Dark Seer could farm with ion shell, a Tidehunter has great early tank and little need for last hits, a Bounty Hunter may want a quick 6 at the expense of gold. But you aren't going to get farm as offlane melee against Sniper.

[Kingz V]

I think it was one of the last games I played where I went brewmaster mid and just got rekt in that style matchup.

I've heard good things about Tidehunter, noted in the other video you posted. Might be someone I need to familiarize myself with.

One of the things I was doing was just randoming to get familiar with more charecters.

I just need to stop playing lol so god dam much, my practice partner might be moving to doto since he got hit with the banhammer.

[GAMEchief]

Yeah, don't random. The stickied "Welcome to Dota - You Suck" tutorial has a list of do-plays and don't-plays for new players. If you random one of the don't-plays, you'll just be feeding for the next hour of your life.

[Kingz V]

It was only AI games /dontkillmepls

[GAMEchief]

It was only AI games /dontkillmepls

ffs

Were they Passive bots too?